Pacer Classic 2010 Thread [Archive]

Blix

10-14-2010, 02:46 PM

Soo, got my Classic in today, after looking for a good "shredder" for weeks. Looked at any old 80's guitar, older Kramers, Ibanezes, Fernandes, Hamer, you name it. After reading nice reviews on the Pacer Classic here, I decided to go for it.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4126/5081315886_a7e2eb7ea8_b.jpg
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4112/5081315654_27779bf3f2_b.jpg

The white pearl finish was a lot niceer than I had imagined!
Setup was pretty good right out of the box, no loose parts(nut) as reported earlier, very clean.

Didn't like the bridge pickup much, just too much mud for me. I installed a Seymour Duncan Custom Custom , and it was a huge improvement for me. EVH used one for a reason. ;) Way more string clarity/defenition and punch. Neck pickup sounds really good though, so it stays for now :)

Also put in a D-Tuna, smart little device!

SD CC and D-Tuna installed:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4090/5081991218_12dd372c40_b.jpg

I have a NOS Original Floyd Rose on it's way, and I will put a Floydupgrades brass block on it. Probably a trem stopper as well, making the floyd flush with the body isn't possible without modifications.

The volume pots sucks IMO, horrible taper, it's almost on/off, and the treble bleed mod makes it even worse, so that cap was snipped when I changed the bridge pickup.

The neck is fantastic! Not Ibby-superthin, not too fat, just damn good!

Very pleased with this bargain of a guitar. It eats my partscaster for breakfast when it comes to tone.

And when it gets upgraded with OFR and brass block, it will be off the charts :thumbsup

I have some ideas for decorating it as well, this thread will be updated as my eBay purchases are coming in... ;)

BUY ONE!!! Killer guitar.

AlanH

10-14-2010, 04:33 PM

Congrats, Blix.

You'll have a lot of fun with this guitar!:thumbsup

I like the shot of it hanging up but the strap looks like it's clinging on to that hook for dear life.

I agree about the pots but I'm usually dialed to maximums on a guitar like this so am not too bothered.

I'd be interested to read about how you get on with installing the OFR. However, to me, the only problem with the Kramer branded one is the wobbly arm which might just need replacing with an OFR arm. Maybe the springs won't last as long but, again, it would be an easy fix.

Enjoy your new purchase and your modding.

Alan

Blix

10-14-2010, 04:57 PM

Thanks.
The volume taper drives me crazy, it will be changed soon! :)

I like a loose trem arm, so I'm fine, but looking forward to the OFR.
Just ordered a brass block and trem stopper from floydupgrades.

:thumbsup

Blix

10-14-2010, 05:15 PM

9 second clip expressing my joy for this guitar:
http://soundcloud.com/amund-blix/joy-1

:)

Blix

10-14-2010, 05:51 PM

Soundcloud seems to be down...

Try here:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=769004&songID=9757641

Blix

10-14-2010, 06:44 PM

And, I ordered Birchwod Casey Tru-Oil and wax to treat my neck like Music Man does. It will be sick!

Blix

10-14-2010, 06:50 PM

Ugh double post, the forum was down for a moment.

But yeah I LOVE the Pacer Classic!

MrScary

10-14-2010, 07:16 PM

Blix

10-14-2010, 07:30 PM

If you cut the cap that is what caused your muddiness in the pickup. That treble bleed mod is important for the pickup to have correct tone.

What are you gonna do with the 910T? Lol

I knew you'd like it. These guitars are amazing!!!!!! I love them. Very much. Hoping for more colors in 2011!!!

At full volume the cap makes no difference, I didn't like the pickup, cap or not... :) The SD CC is way better for me.

What to do with it? Throw it at the neighbors kids or something, haha. Always nice to have a spare around though.

But yeah, I love it, it sure is amazing! Just unbelievable for the price I paid.

Thanks for recommending it Eric!

MrScary

10-14-2010, 07:38 PM

You're very welcome!!

Throw that pickup at me! Lol. Yes...the cap makes a huge difference when rolling back the volume. It treats it as full blast all the way through the pot roll. At full volume it does nothing.

OokraMoO

10-15-2010, 05:40 AM

Tryin to sell my crappy Peavey now to buy a red Pacer.. I just love these things and think if Kramer advertised these properly they'd sell like fucking hotcakes.

espvh

10-15-2010, 06:38 AM

Looks killer Blix!
:thumbsup

Blix

10-15-2010, 06:43 AM

Yeah for sure. They are much better than the price suggests. Maybe that's the problem, they are seen as just another cheap import guitar. I know I did, before finding this forum...

Ordered Trem-Stopper and brass block last night... :)

_xxx_

10-15-2010, 06:50 AM

If you cut the cap that is what caused your muddiness in the pickup. That treble bleed mod is important for the pickup to have correct tone.

It's there to reduce the damping of highs which happens only when rolling back the volume. With volume at 100%, it does exactly nothing.

EDIT: just saw that you mentioned that already above, LOL @ me being slow :D

bongano

10-15-2010, 06:52 AM

I liked that guitar stock, tho. Pups sound killer, lic Floyd is doing its work fine.
If you upgrade her with about, how much, 300$ of extras?, so why don't go for a higher level one? :scratchhe

Blix

10-15-2010, 06:57 AM

Yeah the treble bleed sure isn't a must, I've done fine for 25 years without it. :)

Going to replace the volume pots, as previously mentioned I hate the taper, and they also have travel without any function at the beginning, really annoying.
Will buy good old DiMarzio pots, wich are awesome.

Blix

10-15-2010, 07:01 AM

I liked that guitar stock, tho. Pups sound killer, lic Floyd is doing its work fine.
If you upgrade her with about, how much, 300$ of extras?, so why don't go for a higher level one? :scratchhe

I would probably have bought an Imperial if there were some available, but I couldn't find one..

Nothing wrong with pimping her a little, makes it more "mine" :)

Blix

10-15-2010, 09:45 AM

Ok, first clip with it. Just messing around with an old favorite instrumental from Tony MacAlpine.
I stopped right before the solo, to save myself from public disgrace... :D

Just used a backing track I found. Note the neck pickup on the second "verse", it sounds great!

<object height="81" width="100%"> <param name="movie" value="http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F6103841%3Fsecret_token%3Ds-6sXlX&secret_url=false"></param> <param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param> <embed allowscriptaccess="always" height="81" src="http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F6103841%3Fsecret_token%3Ds-6sXlX&secret_url=false" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="100%"></embed> </object> <span><a href="http://soundcloud.com/amund-blix/tears-3">Tears-3</a> by <a href="http://soundcloud.com/amund-blix">Amund Blix</a></span>

MrScary

10-15-2010, 09:55 AM

That's beautiful dude!!!!:thumbsup:thumbsup

Eric

bongano

10-15-2010, 09:58 AM

Sounds awesome! Congrats! :thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup

Kammo1

10-15-2010, 10:28 AM

Blix great playing and tone you have there and the guitar just looks killer!!:thumbsup

Eivind

10-15-2010, 01:47 PM

That sounds awesome! :drool
Very good playing, too. I love that song.

What gear did you use for recording?

Blix

10-15-2010, 02:29 PM

That sounds awesome! :drool
Very good playing, too. I love that song.

What gear did you use for recording?

Thanks!

Signal Chain is Guitar-Wampler Pinnacle-Roland Micro Cube(headphone output)- Rocktron Interllifex-way old PC.

Recorded in Audacity, recorded as is, no eq etc afterwards.

brokrguy

10-15-2010, 07:46 PM

Congrats and nice playing!

I would never have the balls to hang my new axe up by the strap like that first pic, though...:D

KramerWolf

10-15-2010, 09:17 PM

I see these pictures of the new Pacer... then I walk right in to the other room and see the one they copied it from hanging on my wall, and been with pride and admiration.... Kev.... you guys got it right!

OokraMoO

10-16-2010, 10:05 AM

Anyone else notice the trem arm sticks out just a tad more than other arms? It's not a lot but feels like quite a big difference when playing.

MrScary

10-16-2010, 10:14 AM

I have. Just another one of those things I love about it!

espvh

10-16-2010, 10:57 AM

Anyone else notice the trem arm sticks out just a tad more than other arms? It's not a lot but feels like quite a big difference when playing.

Yup, bent mine already, pita! The screw down thing gets in the way when you try to bend it and you end up bending the shaft that goes into the Floyd, so now you have to bend that straight and start over, but I got to where I feel it belongs, imho.

VooDoo666

10-16-2010, 10:58 AM

The arm is something we have been trying to get changed. They are coming like that for a lot of new trems..not just ours. I know it's been addressed with the manufacturer.

espvh

10-16-2010, 12:11 PM

Like this:

http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn319/jpl20/IMG_1966.jpg

Blix

10-16-2010, 01:52 PM

Ok guys, decoration in progress, this is just for starters :bling

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4128/5087220396_e86ed44867_b.jpg

espvh

10-16-2010, 02:09 PM

Say it ain't so, Take That Off....TAKE IT OFF!!!!!:D

99 In The Shade

10-16-2010, 02:32 PM

please put that on your car, not on such a fine guitar :):)

OokraMoO

10-16-2010, 02:48 PM

:O! KILL HIMMMMMMMMMMM! oh :)

Eivind

10-16-2010, 03:16 PM

Just quoting the forum rules:

"Putting stickers on a genuine Kramer guitar, and posting pictures of it, will result in a permanent ban"

:D

MrScary

10-16-2010, 06:07 PM

Wow..

BeN5150

10-16-2010, 06:21 PM

that looks hilarious!

Leave the stickers on!:thumbsup:lol

Blix

10-17-2010, 01:04 AM

Haha, it's only for one show, don't get all worked up guys ;)

didn't really like those on the neck, so they came off last night. :)

Blix

10-21-2010, 01:18 PM

OFR in today!

Removed the Kramer Floyd, inserts and studs, which was a pretty easy job.
Instant improvement in tone, more bite in the mids for sure with the better metal and steel block. Brass block for it is on it's way... :)

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1166/5102285805_e146889429_b.jpg

99 In The Shade

10-21-2010, 01:50 PM

Space Invaders, aaaaaaaaaah still there aaaaaah

Vengeance

10-21-2010, 02:13 PM

Blix

10-21-2010, 03:07 PM

Very nice and lined up, intonation is overrated... :D

I'm having a brass block for the Floyd coming in a few days, so I'll intonate after I have the block installed.

espvh

10-21-2010, 03:32 PM

Shouldn't the strings line up with the pick up posts better?

Blix

10-21-2010, 03:37 PM

Shouldn't the strings line up with the pick up posts better?

Non F-spaced pickup. It lines up good enough, no problemo :)

espvh

10-21-2010, 04:11 PM

Non F-spaced pickup. It lines up good enough, no problemo :)

Yeah, but it lines up perfect with the Kramer Floyd......

86barettaguy

10-21-2010, 04:20 PM

do the pacers use the same licensed floyds which were used for the old musicyo kramers? hate their effect on tone but might have to go back to using one on one of my guitars...

Blix

10-21-2010, 04:46 PM

The pickup mounting ring is at a ever so slight angle, no biggie for me.

86barettaguy , I'm not really familiar with the musicyos, but I may have read they're the same.

AlanH

10-21-2010, 05:27 PM

It's great when people mod their guitars and that's fine if they enjoy it. However, I'm going to operate an 'ain't broke don't fix it' policy with my Pacer Classic.

I view mine as a £250 'top of budget range' guitar which happens to perform quite a bit better than its price would suggest and is a lot of fun to boot. I like the bite I get with the stock pups and Kramer bridge on that 'mahogany' body and that FR works perfectly (for now at least). I might get a new trem arm but that would be about it at present.

PS. I let my six year old loose on it today and he was strumming a few open fifth dyad power chords. He can manage this guitar on his lap as its so light and comfortable. Great stuff!:headbang

Alan

Blix

10-21-2010, 05:42 PM

Yeah Alan, I bet it's fine as is for most.
It's my main guitar for now, so I felt like upgrading it to where I wanted it to be. :)

I see more and better Kramers in my future though, just started in a new job after a couple very poor years, the Pacer Classic is just an appertizer.... ;)

mmmtacos

10-21-2010, 08:57 PM

You'd be suprised how much better a real Floyd would sound

jumbowolfe

10-22-2010, 08:15 AM

Those crappy Kramer Floyds will be good until the knife edges wear out. They don't last long on those Floyd II type licensed trems. For the guy just playing his Classic in the house and not really wankin on the Floyd all that much, I'm sure it will be fine.

Regardless though, even on the licensed Floyd, I'd still try to attempt to put a better block on it. They do make a difference.

mmmtacos

10-22-2010, 11:24 AM

The ones I had had pot metal saddles.

A real hardened steel floyd of any brand will make a huge difference

_xxx_

10-22-2010, 02:49 PM

Blix

10-23-2010, 04:06 PM

Now we're talking :thumbsup

Indeed! ;)

All stickers are gone, it's white again. Still being the rebel, the DiMarzio I put in the neck position is green/blue though. :funny

And, and this is a BIG one for me, I disabled the tone control completely, and wired both pickups to the first volume pot. Disabling the tone control is the only way to get those sweet semi-clean EVH tones just using your volume to control the dirt, like the Drop Dead Legs intro, and Best Of Both Worlds as examples, well if you are a VH-nut like me... :)

With the tone control in there it just gets muddy when you roll down the volume.
I'm sure using different cap values could clean it up better, but no tone control is the way I like it.
Pure tone all the way!

:toast

MrScary

10-23-2010, 05:16 PM

Yo Blix!,

Whatcha gonna do with that Kramer trem, huh huh huh????

I'll send ya my address. Lol. I could use one.

Blix

10-24-2010, 04:17 AM

Yo Blix!,

Whatcha gonna do with that Kramer trem, huh huh huh????

I'll send ya my address. Lol. I could use one.

Hehe, the cost of sending it to the US from Norway would probably stop you... :)
As most parts are compatible with the OFR, I'll keep it for spare parts.

Get one of these instead, I bet it's way better quality than the Kramer trem anyway http://www.guitarfetish.com/NEW-BLACK-Super-Heavy-Duty-Floyd-Rose-trem-BRASS-STEEL_p_510.html#

OokraMoO

10-24-2010, 06:34 AM

Hey Blix I was looking at those trems the other day on Guitarfetish. Have you bought one? What do you think to it if so?

They say its all been hardened.. any truth in this, how would they stack up?

Blix

10-24-2010, 09:11 AM

Hey Blix I was looking at those trems the other day on Guitarfetish. Have you bought one? What do you think to it if so?

They say its all been hardened.. any truth in this, how would they stack up?

I got an OFR, but these looks really promising, and that they are made by Ping is a plus, they make great FR's. Note that the brass block on it is too short, the Pacer needs a 37mm.

MrScary

10-24-2010, 10:24 AM

I have lotsa pings. I love them. I did t realize you were across the pond. I was wanting to buy that Kramer trem for an old 80's striker I have.

Blix

10-24-2010, 10:59 AM

I have lotsa pings. I love them. I did t realize you were across the pond. I was wanting to buy that Kramer trem for an old 80's striker I have.

Yeah, Norway is a few miles from West Virginia.... :)

A few snaps of the Pacer in it's current state:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4125/5111040998_640d989594_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1246/5111040428_322e640a24_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1106/5110439899_a78d736552_b.jpg

I have a black DiMarzio PAF Pro I'll try in neck as well. Replaced the volume knob with a MXR knob. The other two controls are now just for show, not in the circuit anymore. :)

Blix

10-24-2010, 04:11 PM

So to summarize what's been done to it since I got it:

Changed the bridge pickup to a Seymour Duncan Custom Custom the first day.

Clipped the "treble bleed" caps on the volume controls.

Replaced the Kramer Floyd with an older NOS Schaller FR I found on eBay at a reasonable price, huge improvement right there. Also replaced the inserts for the Floyd studs, the Schaller ones are much tighter with a finer thread.

Put in a DiMarzio Mo'Joe in the neck position as an experiment.

Replaced the Mo'Joe with a PAF Pro.

Disconnected the tone control and wired it so I only use one volume control and finally got the response I wanted out of the volume control, no the tone is consistent all volumes, waaaaaaay better than the "treble bleed" mod it came with stock.

Man this guitar is a machine now!

MrScary

10-24-2010, 05:51 PM

I must be the only one who likes the treble bleed mod. It's perfect for me.

I have two bone stock, one moderately modded and one all out modded and they all have the mod intact. Love it.

BeN5150

10-24-2010, 06:17 PM

I must be the only one who likes the treble bleed mod. It's perfect for me.

I have two bone stock, one moderately modded and one all out modded and they all have the mod intact. Love it.

in the Assault 220 FR I thought the treble bleed mod was nice too, I like a snappy tone, and its nice to be able to roll back and still have that snappy tone

Blix

10-25-2010, 12:33 AM

I must be the only one who likes the treble bleed mod. It's perfect for me.

I have two bone stock, one moderately modded and one all out modded and they all have the mod intact. Love it.

Lucky for you, I had to go all crazy with my soldering iron until I figured out why it wasn't behaving like I'm used to... :D

in the Assault 220 FR I thought the treble bleed mod was nice too, I like a snappy tone, and its nice to be able to roll back and still have that snappy tone

Try it with the tone control removed and bright cap snipped. Doing this, the volume control have a much more gradual function and your tone stays consistent from 0 to 10, the difference is huge! :)

I have always used my volume very actively when I gig, controlling the gain from the amp with my volume between verses and solos and such, so I need it like I'm used to :)

With the tone control and bright cap in place, all I got was mud when I tried to turn down, to me it's terrible and 100% useless.

Blix

10-25-2010, 12:05 PM

Quick clip showing 4 different gain levels using my volume knob:

<object height="81" width="100%"> <param name="movie" value="http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F6391573&secret_url=false"></param> <param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param> <embed allowscriptaccess="always" height="81" src="http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F6391573&secret_url=false" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="100%"></embed> </object> <span><a href="http://soundcloud.com/amund-blix/voltest">Voltest</a> by <a href="http://soundcloud.com/amund-blix">Amund Blix</a></span>

MrScary

10-25-2010, 01:59 PM

Pretty good tone there bro! What are ya using?

aerochris

10-25-2010, 02:08 PM

Is there a way to get these with the case? I haven't been able to find hardshell cases???

Blix

10-25-2010, 02:28 PM

Pretty good tone there bro! What are ya using?

Thanks, but that is a highly guarded secret :jump

Haha, it's the simplest and cheapest recording "rig" ever.

It's this little amp:

http://www.backalleymusic.co.uk/contents/media/rolandmicrocube.jpg

Just a cable from the headphone output straight into the line in on my computer, recorded in Audacity (free simple program) Just straight,no eq or anything.Set on the classic stack setting. The George L cable must be the key here, haha. :)

jumbowolfe

10-25-2010, 04:23 PM

Thats a great guarded secret right there, thats my main practice rig at the house. Sounds great.

I never thought about piping it into the computer into Audacity with the headphone jack, thanks for the tip!

Thanks, but that is a highly guarded secret :jump

Haha, it's the simplest and cheapest recording "rig" ever.

It's this little amp:

http://www.backalleymusic.co.uk/contents/media/rolandmicrocube.jpg

Just a cable from the headphone output straight into the line in on my computer, recorded in Audacity (free simple program) Just straight,no eq or anything.Set on the classic stack setting. The George L cable must be the key here, haha. :)

s_b_g

10-25-2010, 05:04 PM

been fk'n about with mine recently - and it rocks :)

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs818.snc4/69824_10150114020154762_561709761_7717771_3006727_n.jpg

but .. words of caution :)

original floyd didn't fit - so had to file down cavity

also locking nut didn't fit when replaced with original at least 1 to 2 mm out

d

Vengeance

10-25-2010, 05:52 PM

MrScary

10-25-2010, 06:21 PM

My ofr bolted it right up.....:scratchhe

mmmtacos

10-25-2010, 10:20 PM

I it didn't drop right in it's b/c of the trem arm bushing rubbing (probably) just need to take a dremmel to it and home of a bit of wood........(did I guess right?:D)

Blix

10-25-2010, 10:56 PM

Why would you want a non-finetuners Floyd on it?

You probably have the wrong type of nut. The Pacer takes an R3.

s_b_g

10-26-2010, 02:46 AM

I it didn't drop right in it's b/c of the trem arm bushing rubbing (probably) just need to take a dremmel to it and home of a bit of wood........(did I guess right?:D)

hehe absolutely spot on :thumbsup

d

s_b_g

10-26-2010, 06:04 AM

Why would you want a non-finetuners Floyd on it?

Because I like them :)

You probably have the wrong type of nut. The Pacer takes an R3.

No I ordered an R3 but it's not the width that is the problem. I have sent it back to the place I bought it from and asked for a replacement as I think they may have sent me a non-official one

d

Blix

10-26-2010, 08:13 AM

Because I like them :)

No I ordered an R3 but it's not the width that is the problem. I have sent it back to the place I bought it from and asked for a replacement as I think they may have sent me a non-official one

d

Oook :)

They must have sent you the wrong nut then, I have a spare R3 and it it's the same size as the one in my guitar. Replace the inserts/studs for the floyd as well, the OFR ones are much better.

Blix

10-27-2010, 01:54 PM

Just refinished the back of the neck with Birchwood Casey Tru-Oil and Gun Stock Wax..

Feels awesome!

MrScary

10-27-2010, 01:56 PM

I'm in the process of removing the finish from the necks on all of mine. I like them raw. I slide better.

Eric

Blix

10-27-2010, 02:04 PM

I'm in the process of removing the finish from the necks on all of mine. I like them raw. I slide better.

Eric

Yeah, I hate the feel of a lacquered neck, always did.
This is the first time trying the oil/wax stuff and I love it! Feel like an unfinished neck played for years, very smooth and fast, yet still got that raw feel.

Same thing that EBMM does to their necks.

Blix

10-31-2010, 07:31 AM

Final modification done, Floydupgrades brass block and trem-stopper installed:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4017/5131452482_b4aa97397b_b.jpg

Had to route a little extra to get the full motion with the bigger block. Huge improvement in sustain, very noticeable, fuller low end as well.

That's it, the Pacer is complete!

:toast

Blix

11-13-2010, 02:20 PM

Ok I lied, one more "mod" coming up. :D Ordered this:

http://i.ebayimg.com/03/!B8h(YggB2k~$(KGrHqN,!mEEy+jC1qTKBM3S3EugJg~~0_1.JPG

DiMarzio 3-Way 4PDT switch. With that switch I can wire it so the middle position is the inner coils of both humbuckes, just like the Music Man Petrucci. Very nice for clean tones.

I'll have to make the switch hole a little larger, but that's what Dremels are for ;)

OokraMoO

11-14-2010, 06:00 AM

That's gonna look sweet. It's about the only thing that annoys me on me.. the damn flimsy toggle switch.

mmmtacos

11-14-2010, 08:13 PM

Blix

11-22-2010, 09:55 AM

And here we go, final modification done. DiMarzio 4PDT installed :)

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4127/5198159617_29b2e49af2_b.jpg

Shreddyknight

11-22-2010, 10:42 AM

Hey guys..

did you kow if there´s some Pacer Classic model with a bengal burst finish like Steel Panther´s Satchel one??? I mean.. maybe a limited edition .. I´m pretty sure to see one of those at the bay but I can ´t remember if it was a Kramer or Charvel... when I come back was gone.

I´m very GASed with that one.. well.. I´m gasing very easily to say the truth.. but those Classic caught my eye lately.

sixstring

11-22-2010, 10:55 AM

Check this out

http://kramerforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43028

http://kramerforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43223

Blix

11-22-2010, 01:02 PM

And , this tool is pretty damn handy for doing the intonation on the Floyd Roses, a must have!

http://www.stewmac.com/product_images/1lg/0022/The_Key_Detail.jpg

lunchmeat

12-15-2010, 10:18 AM

Hi all, new here. Figured this would be a good place to ask for some input from those who know.

I just got a new Pacer Classic from MF last week and found that the bridge is set up so low that it cannot be lowered any further to get the action down any more, plus the trem bar cannot be pulled back in this configuration. It is still floating, but just barely. I have had several FR type trems in the past in non recessed bodies and never had this issue, they were always mounted high enough to allow full range of action adjustment and allow the arm to be pulled back. I am curious if this is a fluke with this unit, or if they all come that way (since I couldn't find one locally, had to get it mail order). The truss rod needs to be tightened a little which should help lower the action, but I doubt it will be enough to require raising the bridge that much if at all. I suppose I could shim the neck too, but seems kind of silly to have to do that to a brand new guitar. I haven't messed with it yet until I hear if this is normal or not (never got a call back from Gibson, the guy at MF was sort of clueless and just said nobody ever complained).

Anyway, here is a pic of my old Charvel for comparison as well as the Kramer trem. Thanks for any input you may have.

jumbowolfe

12-15-2010, 10:29 AM

I apologize for a late reply to the thread, but....

The original Pacers from back in the 80s (beaks) were meant to be flush mounted with no pull back (sharp) ability available. When the Pacer Imperial (the now discontinued USA reissue) designs were scanned at Gibson, they took the old specs with that same neck pocket depth and made the new Imperial basically the same as a Vintage Pacer. If you mucked around with the neck angle enough with shims, you could keep it floating, but all in all, that was not desired by most of our Kramer forum guys here since the originals mostly were setup to flush mount on the body. My Imperial was setup to float from the factory and I adjusted the neck angle a bit and got it flush (just like a Vintage Kramer would have).

The Pacer Classic I reviewed was setup to float, the neck pocket isn't as shallow as the Imperials they designed. The Classic was derived closely off of the Imperial stuff they scanned, with some tweaks Kevin made. That being said, the Kramer Floyd has a thicker baseplate, thus causing it to not have as much wiggle room when you lower it to get the action right. If you use an Original Floyd Rose, you will have more pull back as the baseplate is more thin.

If you want the Floyd to float more, shim the back of the neck pocket to adjust the neck angle. You'll then be able to raise the Floyd up to a level that will get you a floated setup.

80's Jap and the newer San Dimas Charvels have neck angle "Routed" into the neck pocket, and I hate this because you're stuck with a floating Floyd unless you shim the "front" of the neck pocket. Thats why you have so much room on a non-recessed routed body on a Charvel. Did I say how much I hate this?

Anyway, if you don't know what you're doing with adjusting the neck angle, I suggest taking it to a good luthier who truly understands how to setup a Floyd. A traditional guy at Guitar Center isn't going to know WTF to do to get it right, so you need to find an experienced shredder in your area thats a luthier.

Hope that helps.
Mike

lunchmeat

12-15-2010, 10:57 AM

Mike -

Thanks for the thorough explanation, that helps alot. Makes sense if they were trying to emulate vintage Pacer specs. I'm not trying to keep it true to any specs, I just prefer the trem floating (hence why I like my old Charvel model 2) and never saw one set up like this. The Charvel definitely has a pretty good angle to the neck in the body, but I wasn't aware that it was actually routed at that angle (thanks for the info - learn something new every day). I did buy an American made Vanguard with a non-recessed OFR back in ~1986 and it was set up similar to the Charvel also, tons of room under the baseplate. I don't want a ton of space, just enough to keep it floating and be able to pull back a step or two.

I'll do the truss rod first and see what it looks like and then maybe shim the back of the neck if necessary. Thanks for the quick response and the helpful info. I'm sure it won't be my last question.

- Mark

AlanH

12-17-2010, 08:44 PM

My Pacer Classic 2010 is the same as yours. I'm not too worried about having much pullback but I don't like the fact that the treble side bridge screw is down as low as it can be.

Yes, the action I've currently got should probably not be much lower than it is already but I'd at least like to try to go lower. Having the baseplate parallel to the body helps get the action down a bit more but, for yourself, that gives you even less pull back.....not to mention it should be parallel anyway.

Interesting about the OFR plate being thinner.

Alan

lunchmeat

12-18-2010, 08:25 AM

pointyheadstock

12-18-2010, 11:13 AM

The more I see these 2010 Pacers, the more the GAS fires up.. they look like really nice guitars.:thumbsup

kramernoob

12-19-2010, 11:47 AM

The more I see these 2010 Pacers, the more the GAS fires up.. they look like really nice guitars.:thumbsup

same here, wish I could get a lefty then put an OFR and duncans on it...mmm

jumbowolfe

12-20-2010, 08:26 AM

Here's the deal, vintage Kramers were never made to pull back by default prior to 1985 in the old days, they were setup to sit on the body. By what they did with the Classic, they basically did something in between, more like the 86' ESP bodies where you could have some pull back. I understand your frustration but at the same time, if you want a recessed trem, then buy a recessed trem bodied guitar.

You can lightly shim the front of that pocket and you'll get the effect you're looking for. It won't take much, just a small peice of sandpaper will probably do the trick.

I tightened the truss rod and got the neck adjusted fine, but there just still isn't room left to lower the bridge enough to get the action right for me. Short of shimming the neck, it just won't happen. Too bad because this guitar is great in every other way, but I just don't understand why it would be made like this, even at this price. Never seen one like this. I thought it was just a fluke, but you said yours is the same. The jury's still out, it may just go back.

lunchmeat

12-20-2010, 02:56 PM

Thanks for info. I know I could just shim it to make it like I want, but even as sits from the factory I cannot lower the bridge enough to get the action as low as it could be. I understand the reason for the low bridge based on what you said about vintage Kramers(although my old Vanguard was fine, maybe it was an exception), but don't see why there isn't enough room for a full range of adjustment. I don't mean to sound like I'm putting down an otherwise awesome guitar, especially at this price point. Just my personal preference I guess.

I don't want a recessed trem necessarily. I had an Ibanez RG570 and I think I actually prefer the non-recessed trems, just sitting a little higher than this. Obviously if I had been able to see one in a store, I would have noticed it but noboday near me carries Kramer or would even special order it for me. No big deal, just figured you guys would know about this, and you certainly did. Thanks again for your help.

VooDoo666

12-20-2010, 04:20 PM

lunchmeat

12-22-2010, 09:24 AM

Lunchmeat,

If you feel there is something not right about the action and it's ability to be set up properly, please contact Gibson customer support about having it sent in to get it looked at or replaced. We would be more than happy to take care of it.

Thank you for the reply. I did email and call Gibson last week about this concern but never heard back. If you want to PM me some direct contact info I'll be happy to try again. Thanks.

AlanH

12-30-2010, 07:06 PM

I tightened the truss rod and got the neck adjusted fine, but there just still isn't room left to lower the bridge enough to get the action right for me. Short of shimming the neck, it just won't happen. Too bad because this guitar is great in every other way, but I just don't understand why it would be made like this, even at this price. Never seen one like this. I thought it was just a fluke, but you said yours is the same. The jury's still out, it may just go back.

Update:

I mentioned above that when the springs are too loose, such that the Floyd is pitching slightly towards the neck, you can't get the action down as low as you might do with a parallel baseplate.

Anyway, I've just re-set up my Pacer Classic and I'm measuring the action as 1.4mm on the high E at fret #17 (measured with capo at fret #1 to eliminate nut height as a factor.) NB. I have the low E action set at 1.8mm. Sighting down the edge of the neck I have just a smidge of relief which I'm happy with. The treble side of the Floyd is still screwed down as low as it will go.

I wouldn't really want to go any lower than this is I am getting fret buzz; but not enough to really notice through the amp, especially on a dirty setting. Importantly, there's no choking on string bending.

I dare say a fret dress would enable me to get the action lower still (if I could lower it more) but, alternatively it would allow me to keep these settings and have the guitar completely buzz free.

So, I'm happy at the moment but when buzzing starts to become a problem a fret dress will be forthcoming.

Alan

Sluggy

01-02-2011, 01:56 PM

Does anybody know what the neck measure's at the 1st. fret and the 12th. fret for thickness?

Thank's...

Blix

01-02-2011, 02:32 PM

Does anybody know what the neck measure's at the 1st. fret and the 12th. fret for thickness?

Thank's...

22mm at 1st. fret, 25mm at 12th.

99 In The Shade

01-02-2011, 04:15 PM

Would it make sense to put one of those non F-spaced EVH Humbuckers in that guitar?

Blix

01-02-2011, 04:21 PM

Would it make sense to put one of those non F-spaced EVH Humbuckers in that guitar?

Of course, putting a EVH humbucker in any guitar makes sense ;)

Seemed to work well for EVH in his 5150 guitars as well.

I have the EVH Frankie pickup in my Pacer Special, had a non F-spaced CC in the Classic , no problem at all.

99 In The Shade

01-02-2011, 04:27 PM

Of course, putting a EVH humbucker in any guitar makes sense ;)

Seemed to work well for EVH in his 5150 guitars as well.

I have the EVH Frankie pickup in my Pacer Special, had a non F-spaced CC in the Classic , no problem at all.

Wow I was missing that fact about the 5150 :idea! (It wasn't good for me to tell that, right?)
Even learned something :)

Ok, I'll try it! Thanks :thumbsup

kramernoob

01-02-2011, 04:37 PM

you can do it but your E strings will be weaker...

99 In The Shade

01-02-2011, 04:40 PM

you can do it but your E strings will be weaker...

Curious if they'll ever offer the EVH Frankie with Floyd spacing!?
Is there a big difference between the Duncan Custom Custom and the EVH Frankenstein?

Blix

01-02-2011, 04:41 PM

you can do it but your E strings will be weaker...

It's not really a problem, practically ALL guitas in the 80's came with non f-spaced humbuckers.

Blix

01-02-2011, 04:42 PM

Curious if they'll ever offer the EVH Frankie with Floyd spacing!?
Is there a big difference between the Duncan Custom Custom and the EVH Frankenstein?

I doubt it will come in f-spacing anytime soon.

No, there is not a big difference between a CC and the EVH.

Sluggy

01-02-2011, 06:12 PM

It's not really a problem, practically ALL guitas in the 80's came with non f-spaced humbuckers.

Thats why EVH put the PU in slanted on the Frankie.. Cause the poles didnt line up...

And thank you for the neck info!!!:thumbsup

Blix

01-02-2011, 06:16 PM

Thats why EVH put the PU in slanted on the Frankie.. Cause the poles didnt line up...

And thank you for the neck info!!!:thumbsup

Yet he used the 5150's with non-slanted non f-spaced pickups for years after retiring Frankie, aka, it's not really an issue ;)

And you're welcome :)

Sluggy

01-02-2011, 06:35 PM

22mm at 1st. fret, 25mm at 12th.

Dam i wish it was the same as my old Kramer neck i have.. But it's thicker:arrg

Blix

01-02-2011, 06:38 PM

Dam i wish it was the same as my old Kramer neck i have.. But it's thicker:arrg

What's your old Kramer?

I haven't measured my 84' Pacer Classic, but I don't think it's any thinner.

And if a neck is too thick for you, just sand it thinner, problem solved :)

Personally I think the Pacer classic neck is great.

Sluggy

01-02-2011, 06:51 PM

What's your old Kramer?

I haven't measured my 84' Pacer Classic, but I don't think it's any thinner.

And if a neck is too thick for you, just sand it thinner, problem solved :)

Personally I think the Pacer classic neck is great.

It's a Beretta neck i baught like 20 years ago new.. It measures .807 (or 20.51mm) at the 2nd fret and .900 (or 22.86mm) at the 12th fret... Doesn't seem like much but i know it would prolly bother me somewhat...I really need to put my hands on one of these to see for sure...

Blix

01-02-2011, 06:55 PM

Sluggy

01-02-2011, 07:08 PM

That's the only way of figuring it out I guess, also the Pacer Classic have a R3 nut, wider than my old Pacer with an R2.

Just so we are measuring the same way, I measured from the top of the fret. :)

I measured in the middle of the second fret on the fretboard under the string's to the back of the of neck...Like this
This pic shows them measuring on the 3rd. fret but it's the same for the second fret.....

http://www.themusicfarm.com/pics/rc7x_measure.jpg

Blix

01-02-2011, 07:15 PM

I measured in the middle of the second fret on the fretboard under the string's to the back of the of neck...Like this
This pic shows them measuring on the 3rd. fret but it's the same for the second fret.....

http://www.themusicfarm.com/pics/rc7x_measure.jpg

Well there you go, you asked for measurements AT the 1st and 12th, I gave you that haha ;)

I'll take the frets out of the measurement, and post the new numbers.

Blix

01-02-2011, 07:20 PM

New numbers, 20mm at first, 22.4mm at 12th

I don't have a digi caliper, but it's close enough with the old analog one :)

Sluggy

01-02-2011, 07:38 PM

New numbers, 20mm at first, 22.4mm at 12th

I don't have a digi caliper, but it's close enough with the old analog one :)

Looks to be the same as mine:thumbsup

Yeah i messed up with the 1st and 2nd fret....Sorry bout that....

Thank's again......

Sluggy

01-01-2012, 09:09 PM

Would you get an R3 or a R4 OFR locking nut for the pacer classic?

One is a 10" radius the other is 12" radius...

AlanH

01-02-2012, 06:04 PM

R3 according to this review:

http://www.vintagekramer.com/company77.htm

amerturk

01-02-2012, 06:34 PM

AlanH

01-03-2012, 03:54 PM

I played a used/as new one today. It looked new, very clean but I wasn't really impressed. It is a nice entry level Imperial, but it just wasn't for me. I'm not bashing it, but it did compare to a striker or squire.

Quite right!. They're entry level guitars made with entry level components. It just so happens that, with a few tweaks, they are a blast to play and they sound pretty good too. I do wonder whether the 2011 Pacer Classics are as good as my 2010. The initial order to the Indonesian factory may have had more attention to secure the long term order. Mind you, that theory doesn't seem to be holding true for the new Korean line with the recent evidence of QC issues.

Rick S

01-03-2012, 04:01 PM

As far as I can tell there aren't any issues. Unless I'm wrong (happens plenty) there was one issue.

The initial order to the Indonesian factory may have had more attention to secure the long term order. Mind you, that theory doesn't seem to be holding true for the new Korean line with the recent evidence of QC issues.

AlanH

01-04-2012, 04:45 PM

As far as I can tell there aren't any issues. Unless I'm wrong (happens plenty) there was one issue.

Ah, it's just that in the thread about the guit with the off centre bridge somebody said there was another 2011 model with an issue.

80'sRocker

01-11-2012, 02:47 AM

i've got a 2010 pacer the only problem i had was the bridge pickup it was really muddy so i swapped it out for a duncan and it screams now

kouros

01-25-2012, 01:17 PM

I havent read the whole thread but some people were saying that the treble mod capacitor doesnt do anything when the volume is fully open.

Looking at the way it is wired, I have to disagree. The cap is like a bypass to the volume pots resistance so that the highs go straight to the output.

Some of you might not know but a volume pot is there to control the amount of sound from the pickups that DOESN'T get thrown away, thats why bigger resistance values for the pots gives you more sound (highs) as it is letting less sound get thrown away to the ground of the wiring. When you have your volume pot fully open, the resistence value isnt 0ohm, its 500k (if the pot's value is 500k).

I have a single coil and a humbucker on my guitar and no pots at all. Its like pickups -> switch -> output.

inkomodo.dragon

01-25-2012, 07:39 PM

Let's throw some light into this matter. Here is the circuit diagram from my 2010 Pacer Classic. The only thing I'm not quite sure is the wires used from the neck pickup but since I already changed the wiring I can't be sure. The rest is exactly as it came on mine.

I've read a lot of things about the what the guitar is wired so I would like to adress those points one by one.

POTS
The stock pots are NOT LINEAR. They read A500K which means 500k logarithmic (audio) taper pots. Not only are they labelled that way but I also tested them and they ARE logarithmic.

TREBLE BLEED CIRCUIT
The treble bleed cap is effectively bypassed when the volume pot is fully open. Many guys got confused because the wiring is a bit unusual.

WEIRD CIRCUIT
You'll see that the live wires from the PUPs are soldered to the middle terminal of the volume pots which is quite rare. Usually the output should be wired to that terminal and the live wire to the left one.

If you leave your volume pots full on all the time you might aswell leave the wiring as it is. Switching it to the "proper" way wont make a difference.

kouros

01-25-2012, 09:28 PM

Well.. not wanting to be a pain in the ass but that scheme is a perfect example of what I just said..

inkomodo.dragon

01-26-2012, 04:16 AM

...you'll find that if one of the volume pots is fully open the left terminal is grounded and the other two terminals are sort circuited. Now tell me, How can a capacitor be of any use if both his legs are connected together?

kouros

01-26-2012, 07:21 AM

Why are those two terminals short circuited? That should only happen with a "no load" pot or a standard but modded one.. when fully open, that volume por gets totally out of the circuit and you can clearly hear the difference.

inkomodo.dragon

01-26-2012, 09:45 AM

I think you are mixing things up.

Standard pots, when maxed out, act as a resistor of (roughly) their nominal value. In this case it would be like a 500K-ish resistor to ground, this is the actual load that a PUP sees from any standard pot.

A "No Load" pot is another thing, it has a notch at the end which disconnects the resistive material entirely making the signal pass through like there wasn't any pot/resistor. It works essentially as a single wire so there is no load on the PUP.

On this particular circuit the capacitor is connected to both the left and middle lug so when the pot is maxed out the resistance between those two is roughly cero, bypassing the effect of the capacitor entirely.

kouros

01-26-2012, 02:14 PM

What you said about the no load pot is entirely true and its the same that I said but in other words.

You're wrong in your last sentence. The capacitor conducts electric current so it doesnt matter if theres a 500k or zero resistance between the pot lugs where the capacitor is attached. You only get no sound from the guitar when the volume pot is closed because at that point there's less resistance for the current to go to ground. (Dont forget that the capacitor is wired in paralell, not in series)

With the capcitor wired this way, what will happen is that the volume pot wont work in a "logarithmic" way, it will be more like on/off. This could be fixed with an extra resistor.

I hope this clarified things a bit.

inkomodo.dragon

01-26-2012, 02:51 PM

What you said about the no load pot is entirely true and its the same that I said but in other words.
No, you don't seem to understand the difference between "short circuit" and "open circuit".

The capacitor conducts electric current so it doesnt matter if theres a 500k or zero resistance between the pot lugs where the capacitor is attached.
What??!! :nono

(Dont forget that the capacitor is wired in paralell, not in series)
I don't remember saying otherwise.

Don't take this the wrong way but I give up. At this point I think it's impossible to explain this stuff to you.

To everyone else...
I believe that anyone interested in the stock circuit will benefit from my drawing. Keep in mind that some guys said that their pots came wired "correctly" from the factory. Although I can not confirm this.

kouros

01-26-2012, 03:20 PM

Yeah right, what was I thinking? lol

It does short-circuit the cap when in full volume. :funnel

Broadbandcorpse

03-19-2012, 03:06 PM

Will a D-Tuna fit in the kramer lic floyd?

DarthPhineas

03-19-2012, 05:47 PM

Will a D-Tuna fit in the kramer lic floyd?

it didn't for mine. I have D-Tunas in 2 other types of lic FRs, but this one wants to act up. it will install and be fine when tuning it to D... but when I go to engage it into the normal E position, it won't go up in there properly.

if I'm missing something, I'd be interested in knowing if anyone else has gotten a D-Tuna to work for them. in the meantime, I'm looking to upgrade to a real FR.

UPDATE: wanted to clarify that the problem was with the D-tuna and not the lic FR on the Kramer PC.

Scott Granger

03-19-2012, 10:35 PM

I grabbed a used 2010 red PC for $199. I prefer the white, but had to take this at the price. I already have a MIG Schaller FR and a big brass block. I am thinking of upgrading the pickups and the tuners. Has anyone upgraded the tuners (esp. direct replacements)? I was thinking about some Grovers or Schallers, but I do not want to drill new holes in this thing.

The only 'problems' on this one was that the trem cavity cover was missing and the bottom strap button had been pushed in at an angle. I fixed that (the strap button, that is). I'd like to replace the cover, but that is not a big priority.

OokraMoO

03-20-2012, 05:25 AM

I don't really see why you would upgrade them? The stock ones work excellent and the locking nut eliminates them once locked anyway. Seems like the money would be better spent on a D-tuna or something

VooDoo666

03-20-2012, 08:34 AM

Schallers will drop right in without drilling anything.
I agree with Ookra though.

I grabbed a used 2010 red PC for $199. I prefer the white, but had to take this at the price. I already have a MIG Schaller FR and a big brass block. I am thinking of upgrading the pickups and the tuners. Has anyone upgraded the tuners (esp. direct replacements)? I was thinking about some Grovers or Schallers, but I do not want to drill new holes in this thing.

The only 'problems' on this one was that the trem cavity cover was missing and the bottom strap button had been pushed in at an angle. I fixed that (the strap button, that is). I'd like to replace the cover, but that is not a big priority.

Blitz

03-20-2012, 09:43 AM

Schallers will drop right in without drilling anything.
I agree with Ookra though.

I also agree putting Schaller tuners on a double locking guitar is IMO a bit pointless. If you want to change the tuners and other hardware why not swap it all over for chrome and give it a more vintage look ala early 80's beak neck era? But save your coin and buy none branded tuners.

DarthPhineas

05-04-2012, 12:08 PM

has anyone removed the treble bleeds from the PC? that might be the next mod for me on mine.

I've been trying out several different pickups the past few weeks. the PC has been the test subject, as it's pretty easy with the way I have things set up in the cavity.... it'd be easier if the neck pup had it's own route to get to the cavity without having to go through the bridge cavity. bleh!

anyway, I made a few Duncan 59/Custom hybrids and put one in a mahogany Hamer and the other in this mahogany Kramer. the PC sounded like something is taking a way from a bit of the 'sparkle'... maybe a bit of the upper-mids. where the same pickup sounds much more open in the Hamer, it sounds a bit muted in a few spots in the PC. I'd noticed it previously with a common production model pup in there that had the same thing going on. I went back and forth between several guitars and it's definitely symptomatic to the PC.

I understand that I'm not looking at guitars that are 100% identical, but a mahogany guitar with a maple board should be at least as bright, if not brighter than a mahogany with a rosewood board.

I think I'm going to start with removing the treble bleeds and maybe replacing the pots altogether.

has anyone else noticed anything similar?

Robbaretta

05-06-2012, 08:47 PM

I just picked up a Baretta Special, I was wondering if the stock pickup is the same pickup that comes in the Pacer Classic.

80's Rocker

05-13-2012, 09:03 PM

Blix

05-13-2012, 09:26 PM

You will be fine with just replacing the bridge pickup, and a DSD sounds excellent in it
You also need to disengage the completely useless treble bleed mod and change the volume pot. Personally I disengaged the tone pot as well, I much prefer the tone that way.

The trem is decent as is.

80's Rocker

05-13-2012, 09:42 PM

Hmmm alright then, I really do want one. Do you by any chance know what kind of mods if any Satchel has done to his?

DarthPhineas

05-13-2012, 10:01 PM

So, if I was going to get a white Pacer classic and keep it stock would it be worth it? I really want an 80's shredder with a neck pickup and I am trying to decide if this one would be worth it. If I would have to make a lot of upgrades for it to be worth getting like an OFR, new pickup, or else...I would probably wrather just get a Charvel San Dimas.

Big 2 things I am looking at...is tone and tuning. Does it stay in tune with tremelo abuse and is the tone muddy? Only thing I have spare I could put in it is a DSD.

for less than four bills, it's hard to go wrong. if you have the spare parts sitting around, it's worth the time to upgrade. if you have to buy them, it may end up being close to the cost of a Pacer Vintage... and then you'd have to choose if you wanted the mahogany Classic or the maple Vintage.

or if you want a serious shredder with a neck hum, drop down the serious money and get a Buddy Blaze K2H2.

however, I've been experiencing issues with the Kramer lic FR and am back to looking for an OFR to replace it. not tuning issues, just construction issues.

You will be fine with just replacing the bridge pickup, and a DSD sounds excellent in it
You also need to disengage the completely useless treble bleed mod and change the volume pot. Personally I disengaged the tone pot as well, I much prefer the tone that way.

The trem is decent as is.

also been thinking about swapping the pots. what kind of improvement did you hear when you did that? after taking the same pups out of another mahogany guitar and putting in the PC, I can hear a difference in the tone... as if a slight lack of presence and less sparkle. I dropped the treble bleeds and that helped, but I just started to think about swapping the pots this week as well.

OokraMoO

05-14-2012, 05:57 AM

DarthPhineas

05-14-2012, 08:45 AM

I did what Blix said, except I put in a Duncan Custom Custom. The pots are garbage as he says, I also got rid of the tone out of the circuit (one less pot to buy too xD) and the treble bleed is gone.

The floyd is good, but it's rock solid once it's blocked for dive only, not sure if you like that though, personally, I love it.. I hate playing floating bridges and not being able to drop D.

how do you like that CC in there? I finally tried one earlier this year and liked it better than expected... it's in my 80s neck-thru Stagemaster. I have a regular Custom still in the box and I've been trying to decide if I should make it a CC.

I'm wondering if the issue with it finally being rock solid once it's blocked has to do with the quality of the mounting posts? I do have a tremol-no and a brass block on it and when it's all locked down, it has sustain for days.

OokraMoO

05-14-2012, 09:20 AM

I really like it. A guy over at Metroamp did lots of brown clips through a Bray modded plexi, really great sounding amp for Eds tone.

He tested DSD, JB, CC, regular Custom and a few others

I prefered the CC over the lot of them, had more squish and just sounded better to me, but all of them sounded great really!

80's Rocker

05-15-2012, 10:35 PM

So nobody knows if Satchel's white Pacer is modded or stock lol?

OokraMoO

05-16-2012, 05:08 AM

It's not a Pacer Classic. They're from the old Yo-Pacers from a few years back, way more high quality than the ones we have now.

Sluggy

05-16-2012, 06:46 AM

So nobody knows if Satchel's white Pacer is modded or stock lol?

His are the 2008 Pacer Imperial's not the Classics. :thumbsup

VooDoo666

05-16-2012, 08:32 AM

Yup. His are the Imperials. Other than the paint and setup, they are bone stock. I had the fortune of one of my bands opening for Steel Panther Friday night in Atlanta last week at The Tabernacle and man.....I've never heard those Pacers sound so good. Lexxi's basses are the same as the production D-1's other than paint. He loves them and they sound great live.
Satchel also has a hot rodded Assault 211 and one of the blue with tribal flame 85 Reissues we did. We take good care of those guys. They are without a doubt the most humble and nicest band on the planet and they rip live!

80's Rocker

05-16-2012, 09:12 AM

VooDoo666

05-16-2012, 09:39 AM

Ooooooh...well shoot lol. That explains it, I wasn't aware that's what it really was. And to think I wanted a classic because I thought that is what he played...haha.
Thanks guys!

Glad to hear they are humble and nice! I would loooove to go see them live, but living in Cleveland TN they aren't really around here lol.

The Classic is still a sweet little guitar. The Pacer Vintage is closer to the Imperials in tone. If you got a Classic, I don't think you'd be disappointed, it is a great guitar and in my totally biased :)opinion is the best guitar on the market for it's price range.